EP Review
- Venatus Vinco
- Bronze Patron
- Posts: 2872
- Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:30 pm
EP Review
Hello,
Some questions in the hangouts about the EP rewards system
The first was regarding the auto-ace option
Are auto aces a good idea?
Are they "too cheap" (1 EP)?
Given there are bennies for extra effort and re-rolls, is this even a necessary option?
What would be a better option?
How would we deal with those patrons who gained auto aces as part of their contribution?
The second discussion topic was patron items, the special 50 patron milestone where someone could get a heroic level TW device:
Should we make this available to purchase for EP so that non-patrons can still have access via their contributions to the site?
If so, what should the cost be?
Any other thoughts or limitations?
We have a quarter end coming up on September 30th so now is a good time to discuss any potential changes to phase in either next quarter or in the new year.
VV
Some questions in the hangouts about the EP rewards system
The first was regarding the auto-ace option
Are auto aces a good idea?
Are they "too cheap" (1 EP)?
Given there are bennies for extra effort and re-rolls, is this even a necessary option?
What would be a better option?
How would we deal with those patrons who gained auto aces as part of their contribution?
The second discussion topic was patron items, the special 50 patron milestone where someone could get a heroic level TW device:
Should we make this available to purchase for EP so that non-patrons can still have access via their contributions to the site?
If so, what should the cost be?
Any other thoughts or limitations?
We have a quarter end coming up on September 30th so now is a good time to discuss any potential changes to phase in either next quarter or in the new year.
VV
Signature
Re: EP Review
For most of us, who have relatively few EP, spending one for a one-shot effect is not cheap. I would leave that alone.
In theory, anything should be able to be bought with enough EP if it is available in the game. The question is, how expensive it would be?
In theory, anything should be able to be bought with enough EP if it is available in the game. The question is, how expensive it would be?
Low Light Vision
Alertness - Additional Benefit: Senses Presence of Supernatural Creatures and Ley Line Storms
Danger Sense - Additional Benefit: May detect of food or drink is spoiled or poisoned
Beast Master - Additional Benefit: Monstrous Animals also like the character
Bennies 3/3
Wounds 0/3
Alertness - Additional Benefit: Senses Presence of Supernatural Creatures and Ley Line Storms
Danger Sense - Additional Benefit: May detect of food or drink is spoiled or poisoned
Beast Master - Additional Benefit: Monstrous Animals also like the character
Bennies 3/3
Wounds 0/3
- Hans Greuber
- Diamond Patron
- Posts: 643
- Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2017 2:28 pm
- Location: The Black Company
Re: EP Review
I think the Auto-Ace should be kept, but double the price to 2 EP. This makes the +4 to a roll at 1 EP a viable option. Patrons can keep what they have left for their auto-aces (BTW, I have spent all of my Patron ones), they just have a larger EP value given to them.
As for the Patron items, I think that they should be available for EP. Since you can get a roll on an Equipment HJ chart for 5 EP, that means choice on a chart is worth 10 EP. This starts with that and adds to it. I think that a lower version (1 Minor + 2 Major TW, or 1 Minor 1 Major Magical) upgraded version for 20 EP, with the full Patron level one for 30 EP. This is expensive, but still allows a way to get them... especially if they GM, recruit, or work on Community Projects.
As for the Patron items, I think that they should be available for EP. Since you can get a roll on an Equipment HJ chart for 5 EP, that means choice on a chart is worth 10 EP. This starts with that and adds to it. I think that a lower version (1 Minor + 2 Major TW, or 1 Minor 1 Major Magical) upgraded version for 20 EP, with the full Patron level one for 30 EP. This is expensive, but still allows a way to get them... especially if they GM, recruit, or work on Community Projects.
Re: EP Review
I'd like to see the EP cost of Auto-Aces increased to 2 per. I don't think that will be a huge hindrance to their use, but it'll keep it from being the option of first resort.
At that point, I don't think we need to change anything about the Patron auto-aces. They become more 'valuable', but they'll still get used up eventually.
I do think items should be available, but pricey, and yes, 1/character limit. I'd say either go with the 20-30-pt cost Hans suggested, or go with a progressive cost--start at 15, then add 5/.
At that point, I don't think we need to change anything about the Patron auto-aces. They become more 'valuable', but they'll still get used up eventually.
I do think items should be available, but pricey, and yes, 1/character limit. I'd say either go with the 20-30-pt cost Hans suggested, or go with a progressive cost--start at 15, then add 5/.
Re: EP Review
I feel that the auto-ace option is a fine, but if a bit on the cheap end for its results. I would also place a limit of one auto-ace per post to prevent spamming auto-aces.Venatus Vinco wrote:Hello,
Some questions in the hangouts about the EP rewards system
The first was regarding the auto-ace option
Are auto aces a good idea?
Are they "too cheap" (1 EP)?
Given there are bennies for extra effort and re-rolls, is this even a necessary option?
What would be a better option?
How would we deal with those patrons who gained auto aces as part of their contribution?
The second discussion topic was patron items, the special 50 patron milestone where someone could get a heroic level TW device:
Should we make this available to purchase for EP so that non-patrons can still have access via their contributions to the site?
If so, what should the cost be?
Any other thoughts or limitations?
We have a quarter end coming up on September 30th so now is a good time to discuss any potential changes to phase in either next quarter or in the new year.
VV
OOC Comments
- Severianna
- Diamond Patron
- Posts: 103
- Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:45 am
Re: EP Review
SR has bennies, I feel like auto ace is less necessary. Like Augur said, auto ace can take away a narrative tool or dramatic consequences. Sometime you should fail and not have a way out of it. Not to die, but to rise back from it, to overcome odds. Story arcs and climax requires ups and downs, challenges and consequences. I'd be cool with an EP expenditure to auto save a accidentally killed character. But I would like it if people could fail, fail miserably, fail heroically, and then build a better story about the time they failed and what happened next, and how it was awesome.
Honestly don't feel strongly on the use of EP either way. When I started a character on the EU side when I first came in I was more annoyed that it seemed that everyone else who started a new character who also had previous characters and experience on the site got all sorts of added benefits, abilities and gear at creation. As long as things are explained and it feels like some people aren't getting preferred treatment that's all I would be concerned about.
Honestly don't feel strongly on the use of EP either way. When I started a character on the EU side when I first came in I was more annoyed that it seemed that everyone else who started a new character who also had previous characters and experience on the site got all sorts of added benefits, abilities and gear at creation. As long as things are explained and it feels like some people aren't getting preferred treatment that's all I would be concerned about.
- Maximilian
- Silver Patron
- Posts: 548
- Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2017 2:37 pm
Re: EP Review
I say leave auto-aces. If the cost has to be adjusted, I suppose I can understand. Limiting auto-aces to one per post is a pretty good idea. I think the only time I've used auto-aces is to save my own skin. If I have a character I like, I'd rather have an option to save it if I have the EP.
As far as the EP for TW items, I think it's a valid idea. Not sure where the cost should fall. I like 1 per character limit, and a progressive cost. 30 seems like a high number for a non-paying player to hit, though. They might have only one character and limited opportunity to rack up extra EP.
As far as the EP for TW items, I think it's a valid idea. Not sure where the cost should fall. I like 1 per character limit, and a progressive cost. 30 seems like a high number for a non-paying player to hit, though. They might have only one character and limited opportunity to rack up extra EP.
Maximilian
- Tribe of One
- Posts: 1208
- Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:28 am
Re: EP Review
Increasing the cost of Auto-Aces to 2 EP and limiting them to 1 spent per scene would alleviate my concerns. I'd also make the Patron items available for EP, in the 20-30 range, limit one per character. Starting with a Patron item, extra character slot and earning some bonus EP per quarter seems like a pretty reward for backers, without putting any of those things out of reach of loyal players/GMs/contributors.
GM Bennies: 7/7
Re: EP Review
If we make the Patron Items available through EP, I feel like it should be scaled with the Patron Items representing the pinnacle of what someone could save up for (I think someone said they were considered to be heroic level items) so we'd have:
5 EP Novice Item
10 EP Seasoned Item
20 EP Veteran Item
30 EP Heroic Item
5 EP Novice Item
10 EP Seasoned Item
20 EP Veteran Item
30 EP Heroic Item
OOC Comments
- Jude Maverick
- Diamond Patron
- Posts: 668
- Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2017 6:17 am
- Location: Chicago suburbs
Re: EP Review
Maybe with this, you could "trade up". So buy a Novice item for 5 when you have it available. Then spend 5 EP to add to it for Seasoned later, so it could grow and get better. Require it to be the same item, though, perhaps? Trading out for a new item should be full EP cost?Bane wrote:If we make the Patron Items available through EP, I feel like it should be scaled with the Patron Items representing the pinnacle of what someone could save up for (I think someone said they were considered to be heroic level items) so we'd have:
5 EP Novice Item
10 EP Seasoned Item
20 EP Veteran Item
30 EP Heroic Item
All upgrades subject to GM approval/negotiation, of course, so it would have to "make sense" for the item?
Character Tracker
- High Command
- The Savage Inquisition
- Posts: 1943
- Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:10 am
Re: EP Review
I can live with 2 EP Auto Aces. I'm not happy mind you, but I can live with it. And it does give some value to the +4 1 EP option. They do have narrative value, and artificially limiting them beyond the cost is silly. And in no way should the Patron auto aces be messed with.
I do not at all want EP to equal money. That is an anathema to the entire concept and one I will fight tooth and nail. Getting a few benefits is fine. Literally getting EP for money is not something I'll ever back or support. That has been a constant since the system came into being. You can argue all you like about benefits, but the simple fact is I do not support in any way money = EP.
When we came up with patron items it was with the idea that items are not permanent, and kinda nice, but not game breaking. You can literally do the same thing in game with the right rolls, materials, and characters. Instead of terming it a Patron Item, lets go with a "Signature Item."
I do not at all want EP to equal money. That is an anathema to the entire concept and one I will fight tooth and nail. Getting a few benefits is fine. Literally getting EP for money is not something I'll ever back or support. That has been a constant since the system came into being. You can argue all you like about benefits, but the simple fact is I do not support in any way money = EP.
When we came up with patron items it was with the idea that items are not permanent, and kinda nice, but not game breaking. You can literally do the same thing in game with the right rolls, materials, and characters. Instead of terming it a Patron Item, lets go with a "Signature Item."
- 10 EP: Signature Item:
One item, weapon, armor, gear, or vehicle that fits the concept of the character that follows either the techno-wizard, enchanted item, or modified tech item rules. In general, all items should be Novice or Seasoned in scope. Work with the GM to design and introduce this naturally within the system. Check with your GM BEFORE you purchase this option.
Tales of the 17th SOG
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
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Re: EP Review
Unfortunately this does not reflect the power of TW items are bench marked at Novice, Seasoned and Legendary I would think the following price scheme more sensible with that in mind.Bane wrote:If we make the Patron Items available through EP, I feel like it should be scaled with the Patron Items representing the pinnacle of what someone could save up for (I think someone said they were considered to be heroic level items) so we'd have:
5 EP Novice Item
10 EP Seasoned Item
20 EP Veteran Item
30 EP Heroic Item
EP For Signature Items *
- 10 EP Select item from book as if rolling twice on the same HJ table, (Same as two rolls on table)
15 EP Novice TW Item of choice or Enchanted item with up to 1 major & 2 Minor (Same as three rolls on table)
25 EP Heroic TW Item of choice or Enchanted item with up to 2 majors & 2 Minor (Same as five rolls on table)
NA EP Legendary Item (Should be awarded through play by game masters only)
As to the Auto-ace, I do not see it as a game breaker, but I do think it feels to easy. I think the right spot is 2 EP, so that the 1 EP for a Benny or 1 EP for +4 to a single roll would be more in balance.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
Re: EP Review
What I had posted was merely an example. I don't have much of a clue how TW enchanted item works in Savage Rifts and I don't have easy access to my PDF's (they are backed up on my Google Drive and my only electronic device is my phone).
OOC Comments
Re: EP Review
Actually, TW items can be measured by Rank, if you're looking at Edges and Powers--those are limited to the TW's Rank or less.
- Severianna
- Diamond Patron
- Posts: 103
- Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:45 am
Re: EP Review
what a lot of games give when someone buys a collector's edition or some premium version of a game they give flavor items, cosmetics, etc. Maybe some of the Patron items can be non combat, non skill based something fun. Contacts, pets, followers who don't fight. I don't know, just brainstorming. I hear the desire to give contributors something, but that doesn't always have to be something that adds to power creep or meta Deus Ex abilities.
- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
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Re: EP Review
The powers and edges allowed have ranks, but they are not significant benchmarks in power the way that Seasoned and Legendary are. They tend to be small little bumps, much like a characters natural progression.Freemage wrote:Actually, TW items can be measured by Rank, if you're looking at Edges and Powers--those are limited to the TW's Rank or less.
Note this in an opinion only from my experiences with SW.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
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- Diamond Patron
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- Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:07 pm
Re: EP Review
I haven't used any Auto Aces, and am currently in EP debt (stupid 30 days in June messing with my last needed post) but I can see the argument to bump the cost. 2 EP does seem like a decent price point, as an Auto Aces will always outshine +4 (still has to be declared first, cannot preemptively negate Crit Fails, and at a minimum is worth +4 to a roll*). Just to float additional ideas, rather than increase the cost of the Auto Ace, is there something that can be done to the +4 option to make it worth it?
I would argue that the Benny option should already measure up pretty well. The +4 can be used after the fact, so that adds flexibility in case your dice betray you on what should have been a sure thing. While a Benny for a reroll or Extra Effort at 1 EP might pale next to the auto ace, other uses of a Benny (I'm looking at you Soak Roll and Full Auto**).
Balancing the Signature Items is obviously tougher. Honestly, 20-30 seems high in my opinion considering 10 gets you your choice of any roll from the pawn shop. The Enchanted table gives at least three options that are worth far more than the Patron items I saw get approval. Shadow Cloak is worth 300k credits, the Draining Blade is worth 3 million, and the Staff is the only item I've seen that doesn't need a ley line to recover PPE.
*I have been meaning to ask if just the Trait die Aces or does the wild die Ace as well?
**I could have sworn you could use a Benny to jump initiative order. Is this not the case?
I would argue that the Benny option should already measure up pretty well. The +4 can be used after the fact, so that adds flexibility in case your dice betray you on what should have been a sure thing. While a Benny for a reroll or Extra Effort at 1 EP might pale next to the auto ace, other uses of a Benny (I'm looking at you Soak Roll and Full Auto**).
Balancing the Signature Items is obviously tougher. Honestly, 20-30 seems high in my opinion considering 10 gets you your choice of any roll from the pawn shop. The Enchanted table gives at least three options that are worth far more than the Patron items I saw get approval. Shadow Cloak is worth 300k credits, the Draining Blade is worth 3 million, and the Staff is the only item I've seen that doesn't need a ley line to recover PPE.
*I have been meaning to ask if just the Trait die Aces or does the wild die Ace as well?
**I could have sworn you could use a Benny to jump initiative order. Is this not the case?
Corporal Lucius Draper
- High Command
- The Savage Inquisition
- Posts: 1943
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Re: EP Review
Point of fact, you still have to GET a roll on the table for that to matter, but it is a fair point.Lucius Draper wrote:Balancing the Signature Items is obviously tougher. Honestly, 20-30 seems high in my opinion considering 10 gets you your choice of any roll from the pawn shop. The Enchanted table gives at least three options that are worth far more than the Patron items I saw get approval. Shadow Cloak is worth 300k credits, the Draining Blade is worth 3 million, and the Staff is the only item I've seen that doesn't need a ley line to recover PPE.
Every trait die roll (including wild die) aces. Damage aces too.Lucius Draper wrote:*I have been meaning to ask if just the Trait die Aces or does the wild die Ace as well?
Not unless you have an edge that says so, or an action card that does.Lucius Draper wrote:**I could have sworn you could use a Benny to jump initiative order. Is this not the case?
Tales of the 17th SOG
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
Re: EP Review
As a relatively new player here are my thoughts.
With the +4 option you are effectively buying a raise, provided your actual check succeeds. This is fine and because you have to declare it prior to rolling and it is, IMO, equivalent to a good Extra Effort roll which you can declare after a roll. This balances it out even though extra effort could ace.
Auto Ace on the other hand is a bit more powerful. In most cases it is effectively a +6 or even +8 to the roll. (Using a d6 or d8 skill.) That is somewhat balanced by the need to declare it prior to rolling but is still a major boost. This all but guarantees a moderately skilled character a raise on their check. Unless there are some penalties on this roll that is quite significant. Increasing the cost to 2EP would be well within reason.
Now I can see Severianna's concern about it taking away from a narrative but by the same token it can add to the narrative. Instead of a bit of “extra effort” you put forth a mighty effort to succeed in your chosen task. Being limited to once per scene also helps limit how much effort a character has to give.
---
On the matter of Patron items changing the name to Legacy or Hereditary could make it feel less like a “pay to win” and more like a story driven “My great grand pappy used this in the war....” Having looked over some of the proposed items I don't see any of them as really game changing, not when you have giant robots and Glitter Boys walking around. As for making them available to non-Patrons that is good idea. It may make these Legacy items a bit more common but characters are supposed to be the cream of the crop in some ways.
For pricing I like the suggestion Hans or RFT put out but don't have enough experience with EP (gaining or spending) to know how the economy works. Based on the prices I am seeing though ether one could be balanced.
With the +4 option you are effectively buying a raise, provided your actual check succeeds. This is fine and because you have to declare it prior to rolling and it is, IMO, equivalent to a good Extra Effort roll which you can declare after a roll. This balances it out even though extra effort could ace.
Auto Ace on the other hand is a bit more powerful. In most cases it is effectively a +6 or even +8 to the roll. (Using a d6 or d8 skill.) That is somewhat balanced by the need to declare it prior to rolling but is still a major boost. This all but guarantees a moderately skilled character a raise on their check. Unless there are some penalties on this roll that is quite significant. Increasing the cost to 2EP would be well within reason.
Now I can see Severianna's concern about it taking away from a narrative but by the same token it can add to the narrative. Instead of a bit of “extra effort” you put forth a mighty effort to succeed in your chosen task. Being limited to once per scene also helps limit how much effort a character has to give.
---
On the matter of Patron items changing the name to Legacy or Hereditary could make it feel less like a “pay to win” and more like a story driven “My great grand pappy used this in the war....” Having looked over some of the proposed items I don't see any of them as really game changing, not when you have giant robots and Glitter Boys walking around. As for making them available to non-Patrons that is good idea. It may make these Legacy items a bit more common but characters are supposed to be the cream of the crop in some ways.
For pricing I like the suggestion Hans or RFT put out but don't have enough experience with EP (gaining or spending) to know how the economy works. Based on the prices I am seeing though ether one could be balanced.
Character
Re: EP Review
I did come up with another notion re: Auto-Ace.
Perhaps a 1-point "Auto-Max" instead, or in addition a 2-point Auto-Ace?
1 EP: Auto-Max: Your Skill Die is treated as having rolled its maximum value, but does NOT Ace. This can be combined with the 1 EP +4 bonus to a roll. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
2 EP: Auto-Ace: Your Skill Die is treated as an Ace. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
3 EP: Power Ace: Both your Skill Die and your Wild Die are treated as Acing.
Perhaps a 1-point "Auto-Max" instead, or in addition a 2-point Auto-Ace?
1 EP: Auto-Max: Your Skill Die is treated as having rolled its maximum value, but does NOT Ace. This can be combined with the 1 EP +4 bonus to a roll. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
2 EP: Auto-Ace: Your Skill Die is treated as an Ace. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
3 EP: Power Ace: Both your Skill Die and your Wild Die are treated as Acing.
Re: EP Review
Auto-Aces may not apply to damage rolls, even though they CAN ace normally. An interesting idea I just had was to allow the +4 to apply to damage rolls and can be declared after the roll, but limit it to once per roll.
OOC Comments
- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
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- Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 12:55 pm
- Location: Skagit County, Washington
- Contact:
Re: EP Review
Freemage wrote:I did come up with another notion re: Auto-Ace.
Perhaps a 1-point "Auto-Max" instead, or in addition a 2-point Auto-Ace?
1 EP: Auto-Max: Your Skill Die is treated as having rolled its maximum value, but does NOT Ace. This can be combined with the 1 EP +4 bonus to a roll. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
2 EP: Auto-Ace: Your Skill Die is treated as an Ace. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
3 EP: Power Ace: Both your Skill Die and your Wild Die are treated as Acing.
I really like this, but I would suggest changing "Skill" to "Trait" mechanically both Attributes and Skills are considered traits so a Vigor test to stay alive for example would not be considered a skill roll, but it would be a Trait roll.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
Re: EP Review
I actually MEANT Trait, but typed Skill because I'm easily distr--SQUIRREL!RFT wrote:Freemage wrote:I did come up with another notion re: Auto-Ace.
Perhaps a 1-point "Auto-Max" instead, or in addition a 2-point Auto-Ace?
1 EP: Auto-Max: Your Skill Die is treated as having rolled its maximum value, but does NOT Ace. This can be combined with the 1 EP +4 bonus to a roll. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
2 EP: Auto-Ace: Your Skill Die is treated as an Ace. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
3 EP: Power Ace: Both your Skill Die and your Wild Die are treated as Acing.
I really like this, but I would suggest changing "Skill" to "Trait" mechanically both Attributes and Skills are considered traits so a Vigor test to stay alive for example would not be considered a skill roll, but it would be a Trait roll.
Re: EP Review
I personally would say that the there is no real reason to have the third option as when the auto-ace option (or auto-max as the case may be) is used, it is assumed to apply to the highest die type for the trait test, whether that happens to be a d6 if the Trait is a d4 (using the Wild Die in this case) or d6 (either the Trait or Wild Die) or d8 and better (Trait Die only unless a certain Legendary Trait is obtained).Freemage wrote:I did come up with another notion re: Auto-Ace.
Perhaps a 1-point "Auto-Max" instead, or in addition a 2-point Auto-Ace?
1 EP: Auto-Max: Your Skill Die is treated as having rolled its maximum value, but does NOT Ace. This can be combined with the 1 EP +4 bonus to a roll. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
2 EP: Auto-Ace: Your Skill Die is treated as an Ace. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
3 EP: Power Ace: Both your Skill Die and your Wild Die are treated as Acing.
The only instance where Acing both the Trait and Wild Die MIGHT be beneficial is it gives a 1 in 3 chance of either die Acing on its own if the die type for the Trait is a d6 (technically speaking, if a d8 Trait had the Wild Die Ace, chances are pretty good that the resulting total would be better than the Trait Die itself). That's not something that I would drop 3 EP for.
OOC Comments
Re: EP Review
Is it assumed to be the highest die-type for the test? I thought it was just the Trait die, period (so a d4 gets you a 4-Ace, not a 6-Ace). Note that subbing in the wild die for the auto-ace actually gives you a chance of suffering backlash or innocent bystanders (which ONLY check against the Skill die, not the Wild die).Bane wrote:I personally would say that the there is no real reason to have the third option as when the auto-ace option (or auto-max as the case may be) is used, it is assumed to apply to the highest die type for the trait test, whether that happens to be a d6 if the Trait is a d4 (using the Wild Die in this case) or d6 (either the Trait or Wild Die) or d8 and better (Trait Die only unless a certain Legendary Trait is obtained).Freemage wrote:I did come up with another notion re: Auto-Ace.
Perhaps a 1-point "Auto-Max" instead, or in addition a 2-point Auto-Ace?
1 EP: Auto-Max: Your Skill Die is treated as having rolled its maximum value, but does NOT Ace. This can be combined with the 1 EP +4 bonus to a roll. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
2 EP: Auto-Ace: Your Skill Die is treated as an Ace. You still roll your Wild Die as normal.
3 EP: Power Ace: Both your Skill Die and your Wild Die are treated as Acing.
The only instance where Acing both the Trait and Wild Die MIGHT be beneficial is it gives a 1 in 3 chance of either die Acing on its own if the die type for the Trait is a d6 (technically speaking, if a d8 Trait had the Wild Die Ace, chances are pretty good that the resulting total would be better than the Trait Die itself). That's not something that I would drop 3 EP for.
That said, yes, the 3-point is basically an attempt to get two opportunities to Ace. It's not a huge bump from the 2-point version, but I threw it out there to see if anyone found it intriguing.
Re: EP Review
I like the idea of allowing for Patron Items, or Legacy Items, or [Insert Your Name of Choice Here] Items for purchase with EP. I'm waiting for the first of the month for my Patreon benefits to kick in, but I got a head start on making an item for Hardin so it's ready to go on day one. Building it was a fun process, and I'd like to be able to do that for other characters, too.
Hardin and Jane
- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
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Re: EP Review
I really like the idea of calling it a "Signature Item".
Mostly because it seams we are all using them for cool things that accent our characters.
Mostly because it seams we are all using them for cool things that accent our characters.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
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- Diamond Patron
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Re: EP Review
@Pat.
For the HJ Rolls related to the signature item I was relating their EP value. For 10EP I can get two rolls on the Enchanted table, so two chances to roll what I want. If that fails I can then trade both in to make sure of it. That's why I use the tables as a reference for the cost.
For Aces, I was referring to Auto Ace. Right now, if I spend an EP or use a Patron Auto Ace, do both Trait and Wild die Ace? As pointed out in subsequent posts, it increases the chances of a second Ace. It also makes it more valuable for skills with a d4 rating.
I like the idea of the Auto Max and Auto Ace. I would suggest Auto Ace allowing the option of Skill or Wild at players choice.
For the HJ Rolls related to the signature item I was relating their EP value. For 10EP I can get two rolls on the Enchanted table, so two chances to roll what I want. If that fails I can then trade both in to make sure of it. That's why I use the tables as a reference for the cost.
For Aces, I was referring to Auto Ace. Right now, if I spend an EP or use a Patron Auto Ace, do both Trait and Wild die Ace? As pointed out in subsequent posts, it increases the chances of a second Ace. It also makes it more valuable for skills with a d4 rating.
I like the idea of the Auto Max and Auto Ace. I would suggest Auto Ace allowing the option of Skill or Wild at players choice.
Corporal Lucius Draper
- Pender Lumkiss
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Re: EP Review
Some other options:
- GM's Friend: GM will not target you this round of combat, or if played on your turn until the following round.
- GM's girlfried/boyfriend: GM gives you an extra benny for saying something too cute, and lets you add your wild die to your trait die.
- The Merry Sue: You just have to have the spot light shine on you in this moment. All enemies engage only you in witty banter and if appropriate attack you mercilessly.
- Plot protection Armor: For this scene, go hog wild, do something heroic and stupid, why even bother with cover? You cannot die for the duration of the scene.
Field Team Six Bennies
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Re: EP Review
It's Mary Sue
No, but I laughed. Lots.
No, but I laughed. Lots.
Tales of the 17th SOG
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
- Radecliffe
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Re: EP Review
I like Freemage's idea of the 1EP auto max, 2 EP auto ace and it still leaves the +4 option with some use since it would be especially beneficial for instances where your are rolling a lower die and the +4 providing a better bonus than an auto max. Also, I assume that the +4 would apply to the roll (i.e. both dice) rather than just the trait die?
I also think that Signature Items are a good idea though I think that 20+ EP is very excessive. I agree that it is a reasonable evaluation of an item's value but income has to be taken into consideration too. A person with one character posting 20+ times a quarter will take nearly seven quarters to earn that much EP and that assumes not spending any of it on anything else. That just doesn't seem realistic to me. If this is in response to feelings that "play to win" exists due to patron rewards I don't see this helping matters any. Personally I'd go with a incremental scale similar to character slots: 5 (1st), 10 (2nd), 15 (3rd), 20 (4+). I think this is more reasonable though I could also see adding another +5 to each level if the former costs were considered to inexpensive.
I also think that Signature Items are a good idea though I think that 20+ EP is very excessive. I agree that it is a reasonable evaluation of an item's value but income has to be taken into consideration too. A person with one character posting 20+ times a quarter will take nearly seven quarters to earn that much EP and that assumes not spending any of it on anything else. That just doesn't seem realistic to me. If this is in response to feelings that "play to win" exists due to patron rewards I don't see this helping matters any. Personally I'd go with a incremental scale similar to character slots: 5 (1st), 10 (2nd), 15 (3rd), 20 (4+). I think this is more reasonable though I could also see adding another +5 to each level if the former costs were considered to inexpensive.
- Hans Greuber
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Re: EP Review
Since 10 EP is for choice of Weapon/Armor (2 HJ Rolls), then for 15 EP Give them a Signature Item and add 2 Minor and 1 Major (1 Major and 1 Minor for non-TW)... then for an additional 10 EP (Total 25), add the remaining Upgrades to the earlier Signature Item to bring it on par with the Patron Items. Any character can only have 1 Signature/Patron Item at any time.Radecliffe wrote:I also think that Signature Items are a good idea though I think that 20+ EP is very excessive. I agree that it is a reasonable evaluation of an item's value but income has to be taken into consideration too. A person with one character posting 20+ times a quarter will take nearly seven quarters to earn that much EP and that assumes not spending any of it on anything else. That just doesn't seem realistic to me. If this is in response to feelings that "play to win" exists due to patron rewards I don't see this helping matters any. Personally I'd go with a incremental scale similar to character slots: 5 (1st), 10 (2nd), 15 (3rd), 20 (4+). I think this is more reasonable though I could also see adding another +5 to each level if the former costs were considered to inexpensive.
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Re: EP Review
I did read the above posts so I do realize the goal is one item/character. I did not realize anything I wrote would indicate otherwise. I apologize if that was not clear.Hans Greuber wrote:Since 10 EP is for choice of Weapon/Armor (2 HJ Rolls), then for 15 EP Give them a Signature Item and add 2 Minor and 1 Major (1 Major and 1 Minor for non-TW)... then for an additional 10 EP (Total 25), add the remaining Upgrades to the earlier Signature Item to bring it on par with the Patron Items. Any character can only have 1 Signature/Patron Item at any time.Radecliffe wrote:I also think that Signature Items are a good idea though I think that 20+ EP is very excessive. I agree that it is a reasonable evaluation of an item's value but income has to be taken into consideration too. A person with one character posting 20+ times a quarter will take nearly seven quarters to earn that much EP and that assumes not spending any of it on anything else. That just doesn't seem realistic to me. If this is in response to feelings that "play to win" exists due to patron rewards I don't see this helping matters any. Personally I'd go with a incremental scale similar to character slots: 5 (1st), 10 (2nd), 15 (3rd), 20 (4+). I think this is more reasonable though I could also see adding another +5 to each level if the former costs were considered to inexpensive.
However, my question was and is: how many years is it reasonable to require a player to save up in order to equip one character with a signature item?
- Ndreare
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Re: EP Review
That is a good way of looking at it. Basically like asking how many minimum wage hours is it worth in economics.Radecliffe wrote:I did read the above posts so I do realize the goal is one item/character. I did not realize anything I wrote would indicate otherwise. I apologize if that was not clear.Hans Greuber wrote:Since 10 EP is for choice of Weapon/Armor (2 HJ Rolls), then for 15 EP Give them a Signature Item and add 2 Minor and 1 Major (1 Major and 1 Minor for non-TW)... then for an additional 10 EP (Total 25), add the remaining Upgrades to the earlier Signature Item to bring it on par with the Patron Items. Any character can only have 1 Signature/Patron Item at any time.Radecliffe wrote:I also think that Signature Items are a good idea though I think that 20+ EP is very excessive. I agree that it is a reasonable evaluation of an item's value but income has to be taken into consideration too. A person with one character posting 20+ times a quarter will take nearly seven quarters to earn that much EP and that assumes not spending any of it on anything else. That just doesn't seem realistic to me. If this is in response to feelings that "play to win" exists due to patron rewards I don't see this helping matters any. Personally I'd go with a incremental scale similar to character slots: 5 (1st), 10 (2nd), 15 (3rd), 20 (4+). I think this is more reasonable though I could also see adding another +5 to each level if the former costs were considered to inexpensive.
However, my question was and is: how many years is it reasonable to require a player to save up in order to equip one character with a signature item?
I would think if a player was not contributing in any way other than playing I would expect about a year to a year and a half would be reasonable. Someone who actively contributes to the site in other ways obviously less. By this reasoning it makes the 'price' I suggested way to hi, and calibrates my thinking a bit.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Radecliffe
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Re: EP Review
Ah, then my second question is what opportunities are there for a player to earn EP outside of posting?RFT wrote: That is a good way of looking at it. Basically like asking how many minimum wage hours is it worth in economics.
I would think if a player was not contributing in any way other than playing I would expect about a year to a year and a half would be reasonable. Someone who actively contributes to the site in other ways obviously less. By this reasoning it makes the 'price' I suggested way to hi, and calibrates my thinking a bit.
Recruitment posts are fine if you happen to be on a lot of different boards though there aren't any guidelines I can see as to how often you can dip into the same well and get credit for it.
The Explorer Menu also mentions contests and community projects but in the six months that I've been here I've not seen any contests unless you count the naming the blog thing and I didn't see anything in that thread about who, if anyone, won it.
For community projects it looks like there may be something on regarding equipment conversions but there really isn't much in the way of guidelines indicated what kind of contributions are desired and what the player can expect as a reward.
The only other option is to GM and regardless of a player's desire to do so there are only so many slots to go around.
The only reason I bring any of this up is that if you want to price objects on maximum participation then the opportunity for maximum participation needs to be more accessible IMHO.
Now, to be clear what I DO NOT want to turn this into is a criticism of how things work on this site. I like this site very much and I appreciate the work the people running the site put into it. I may have signed up on Patreon to get the rewards but I have and will remain one in order to support this site.
- Ndreare
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Re: EP Review
I know myself I joined in April and have found a lot of opportunities.Radecliffe wrote: Ah, then my second question is what opportunities are there for a player to earn EP outside of posting?
- When a chance was posted for people to build a summary of TW rules to earn EP, I jumped on it.
When EP was offered for making a spreadsheet that included the CR for all monsters from the main book I jumped on it.
When EP was offered for GMing, I jumped on it, thinking I like EP.
I also recruited (and lucky me I got 7 new players).
But, to be honest, I jumped on all of those so fast I doubt there was a lot of opportunity for others.
Perhaps a graduated cost for Signature items following the exact same path as New Character's is a fair way of doing it?
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
Re: EP Review
I think we're at the point of everyone agreeing that there should be SOME sort of option for getting a gear item, there's a fair bit of back-and-forth about fine details. May I propose a poll:
1: Patreon-level item, fixed EP cost
2: Patreon-level item, scaling EP cost
3: Fixed Signature item, fixed EP cost
4: Fixed Signature item, scaling EP cost
5: Upgradeable Signature item, fixed EP cost
6: Upgradeable Signature item, scaling EP cost
Once we get a particular route agreed upon, then we could focus the discussion on what the costs should be.
To be clear:
A Patron-level item is 4 Major/2 Minor for TW items, or 2 Major/2 Minor for enchanted gear (no Tech Difficulties, no PPE needed to activate), or 3 Major/2 Minor for ultra-tech items (Tech Difficulties, but does not use PPE).
A "Signature" item, for this poll, is a weaker model: 2 Major/2 Minor for a TW item, 1 Major/2 Minor for other types of gear.
The Upgradeable option would mean that there would be a further EP cost that could be used to further enhance the item up to the Patron level. "Fixed" would mean just that--you get that base item, and any upgrades have to be applied in-game (which will be tricky for enchantments or ultratech, but at least fairly straightforward for TW gear).
The options everyone has been putting forward seem to fall into those six categories. If there's anything else being considered for gear, then we can add that too, but I think that covers it.
If there's a clear winner, we go with that (and start discussing costs), if not, we pick the top two or three and hold a second vote.
1: Patreon-level item, fixed EP cost
2: Patreon-level item, scaling EP cost
3: Fixed Signature item, fixed EP cost
4: Fixed Signature item, scaling EP cost
5: Upgradeable Signature item, fixed EP cost
6: Upgradeable Signature item, scaling EP cost
Once we get a particular route agreed upon, then we could focus the discussion on what the costs should be.
To be clear:
A Patron-level item is 4 Major/2 Minor for TW items, or 2 Major/2 Minor for enchanted gear (no Tech Difficulties, no PPE needed to activate), or 3 Major/2 Minor for ultra-tech items (Tech Difficulties, but does not use PPE).
A "Signature" item, for this poll, is a weaker model: 2 Major/2 Minor for a TW item, 1 Major/2 Minor for other types of gear.
The Upgradeable option would mean that there would be a further EP cost that could be used to further enhance the item up to the Patron level. "Fixed" would mean just that--you get that base item, and any upgrades have to be applied in-game (which will be tricky for enchantments or ultratech, but at least fairly straightforward for TW gear).
The options everyone has been putting forward seem to fall into those six categories. If there's anything else being considered for gear, then we can add that too, but I think that covers it.
If there's a clear winner, we go with that (and start discussing costs), if not, we pick the top two or three and hold a second vote.
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Re: EP Review
I'd be inclined to let people purchase a Patron-level item using EP, limited to one per character, at a fixed cost. That would be of interest even to Patrons, since they only get one item regardless of how many characters they run.
GM Bennies: 7/7
- Jude Maverick
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Re: EP Review
I like the idea of upgradeable signature items for non-patrons. That means that they can eventually get up to a Patron level item, but those willing to support the site financially get it "immediately". A bit like microtransactions on your smart phone games. You can play for free, and it isn't play to win, but it just takes longer. Like with characters, I could have waited several months to earn the EP for my third, or I could become a Patron and get it NOW (more or less, subject to verification).
Still one Patron item per patron, and one signature per character. But Patrons can purchase and upgrade signature items just like anyone else. But no outright purchasing of Patron items. You should have to "buy up" to that level.
Still one Patron item per patron, and one signature per character. But Patrons can purchase and upgrade signature items just like anyone else. But no outright purchasing of Patron items. You should have to "buy up" to that level.
Character Tracker
Re: EP Review
My preferences in order:
Upgradeable Signature, Fixed cost
Upgradeable Signature, Scaling cost
Patreon-level, Fixed cost
Patreon-level, Scalling cost
I really don't like the idea of “Fixed Signature” because as a character advances the Powers and Edges they gain access to increases. Though I can see some items never changing I would like to at least have the option out there for those that think their items need to “power up” as they do. In addition there is the economy of being able to afford a "starter signature item" as opposed to needing to buy the whole thing at one time.
I think a fixed cost for these options is a better idea because they have already payed a scaling cost just to get the extra characters.
Upgradeable Signature, Fixed cost
Upgradeable Signature, Scaling cost
Patreon-level, Fixed cost
Patreon-level, Scalling cost
I really don't like the idea of “Fixed Signature” because as a character advances the Powers and Edges they gain access to increases. Though I can see some items never changing I would like to at least have the option out there for those that think their items need to “power up” as they do. In addition there is the economy of being able to afford a "starter signature item" as opposed to needing to buy the whole thing at one time.
I think a fixed cost for these options is a better idea because they have already payed a scaling cost just to get the extra characters.
Character
Re: EP Review
Okay, can we add a poll to this thread, with the options I listed above? No one seems to be saying, "You forgot about...", so we may as well focus on the decision-making process.
- Pender Lumkiss
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Re: EP Review
Any thought for an EP expenditure, similar to phone a friend... Contact a Legionaire: When things are just not going your way, and your group is next to useless, it is a good thing you are part of an organization of damn near super heroes called the Tomorrow Legion. Hop on your radio with a quick S.O.S and call a fellow legionaire to get some advice on your current conundrum. The invited other legionnaire may make a helpful skill or trait roll to help you in your current situation. If they have a weapon that can reach 800" they may make a shooting roll if required... Deviation rules apply.
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Re: EP Review
I would love this, but to be clear we need one edit.
You accidentally said "damn near superheroes" where are the Legion is made up of Superheroes and I would not want to insult any active characters.
With that is mind it should be more like...
You accidentally said "damn near superheroes" where are the Legion is made up of Superheroes and I would not want to insult any active characters.
With that is mind it should be more like...
Other edits may be suggested by others, but lets get the essentials first.Pender Lumkiss wrote:Any thought for an EP expenditure, similar to phone a friend... Contact a Legionnaire: When things are just not going your way, and your group is next to useless, it is a good thing you are part of an organization of superheroes called the Tomorrow Legion. Hop on your radio with a quick S.O.S and call a fellow Legionnaire to get some advice on your current conundrum. The invited other legionnaire may make a helpful skill or trait roll to help you in your current situation. If they have a weapon that can reach 800" they may make a shooting roll if required... Deviation rules apply.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Venatus Vinco
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Re: EP Review
OKay,
Good discussion here and on hangouts. Thanks!!
Here's what I am thinking/intend.
1) Raise cost of Auto Ace to 2 E.P. - effective next quarter.
2) Add "Signature Item" EP Award (basically the patron item): Heroic TW weapon or equivalent using our Enchanted Items or Super Tech rules. Limit 1 per character. 10 EP each...this should allow access to the cool items and gear for everyone regardless of being a patron or not and helps make each of our characters a little more fun. This can go into effect next quarter and gives something other than character accounts to spend EP on.
I really thought about this one a lot. On EU the things we use EP for are done with advances in the SW system (raise attributes, increase skills, additional skills, gain contacts, etc.). No one, especially me, wants to see EP for advances. What seems to be harder to get in Savage Rifts is gear, cause of the Legion pay, smaller gear inventory, etc. So this feels like a really good fit - especially with our ability to make TW, Enchanted, or Tech items that are relatively balanced to one another.
3) Patron Awards (given quarterly)
All this is in addition to any special milestones (e.g. Signature Item, character accounts, etc.).
This seems like a happy medium, the numbers are similar to those used on EU but are matched up to quarters and given out more frequently than annually. Adventure Cards are a fun extra, or can be traded if you just want the cash. This system also leaves a lot less admin. I deposit the amount in your ledger and you choose how to spend it and it renews, unlike existing benefits. Anyone with existing benefits can hold on to those until they're all gone (auto-aces, adventure cards, etc.). The amounts earned are possible for non-patrons to earn with having multiple characters, GMing, doing community projects etc. So it shouldn't create too much disparity.
Consider this a final draft. I'll leave this here until October 1st, see if there are any final changes, and we'll go from there to see how it works.
Thanks everyone.
VV
Good discussion here and on hangouts. Thanks!!
Here's what I am thinking/intend.
1) Raise cost of Auto Ace to 2 E.P. - effective next quarter.
2) Add "Signature Item" EP Award (basically the patron item): Heroic TW weapon or equivalent using our Enchanted Items or Super Tech rules. Limit 1 per character. 10 EP each...this should allow access to the cool items and gear for everyone regardless of being a patron or not and helps make each of our characters a little more fun. This can go into effect next quarter and gives something other than character accounts to spend EP on.
I really thought about this one a lot. On EU the things we use EP for are done with advances in the SW system (raise attributes, increase skills, additional skills, gain contacts, etc.). No one, especially me, wants to see EP for advances. What seems to be harder to get in Savage Rifts is gear, cause of the Legion pay, smaller gear inventory, etc. So this feels like a really good fit - especially with our ability to make TW, Enchanted, or Tech items that are relatively balanced to one another.
3) Patron Awards (given quarterly)
- Bronze: 1 EP per Quarter (4 per year)
- Silver: 1 EP per Quarter (4 per year) & 1 character gets an additional adventure card use (1 EP value)
- Gold: 2 EP per Quarter (8 per year) & 1 character gets an additional adventure card use (1 EP value)
- Ruby: 2 EP per Quarter (8 per year) & all characters get an additional adventure card use (Max 2 EP Value)
- Diamond: 3 EP per Quarter (12 per year) & all characters get an additional adventure card use (Max 2 EP Value)
All this is in addition to any special milestones (e.g. Signature Item, character accounts, etc.).
This seems like a happy medium, the numbers are similar to those used on EU but are matched up to quarters and given out more frequently than annually. Adventure Cards are a fun extra, or can be traded if you just want the cash. This system also leaves a lot less admin. I deposit the amount in your ledger and you choose how to spend it and it renews, unlike existing benefits. Anyone with existing benefits can hold on to those until they're all gone (auto-aces, adventure cards, etc.). The amounts earned are possible for non-patrons to earn with having multiple characters, GMing, doing community projects etc. So it shouldn't create too much disparity.
Consider this a final draft. I'll leave this here until October 1st, see if there are any final changes, and we'll go from there to see how it works.
Thanks everyone.
VV
Signature
- Ndreare
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Re: EP Review
I really like this.
It feels right and balanced.
It feels right and balanced.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Thrudh Zebrem
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Re: EP Review
Does this mean the patron auto-aces are going away as a benefit? I was going to up my support to gold to get the auto-aces, and I still probably will because I like the site, but it'll be nice to know what I'm signing up for.
Thrudh Zebrem
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Re: EP Review
Yes. Instead what you'll get is EP - which can be spent on auto-aces (or anything else you want) - although currently Gold level does not get auto-aces (they start at Ruby).Thrudh Zebrem wrote:Does this mean the patron auto-aces are going away as a benefit? I was going to up my support to gold to get the auto-aces, and I still probably will because I like the site, but it'll be nice to know what I'm signing up for.
Under the existing tier a Gold Patron would receive:
- Gold rank that shows that you're a Patron.
One-time podcast shout-out for your new patronage!
Priority access to our monthly Roll20 adventures.
One-time reward of any Adventure card from the deck not already in use (5 EP value)
One-time reward of an Inactive Character Slot (3 EP value)
Under the proposed arrangement a Gold Patron would receive:
- Gold rank that shows that you're a Patron.
One-time podcast shout-out for your new patronage!
Priority access to our monthly Roll20 adventures.
One additional adventure card per quarter
2 EP per quarter (8 annually)
That's a lot of auto-aces, potential new characters, a signature item, or many other things.
EDIT: Upon spelling that out...I wonder if allowing trading in Adventure Cards is too much...that would be a lot of extra EP per year even with the limit of 2.
VV
Signature
- Radecliffe
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Re: EP Review
That looks really good, kudos.
Would it be possible to add to the EP menu a way to acquire a new piece of cyberware similar to the Upgrade edge? The edge itself would be good if you could take it more than once per rank.
Would it be possible to add to the EP menu a way to acquire a new piece of cyberware similar to the Upgrade edge? The edge itself would be good if you could take it more than once per rank.
- High Command
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Re: EP Review
Works
Tales of the 17th SOG
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
- Pender Lumkiss
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Re: EP Review
Sad that Mary Sue or contact a legionaire did not make the cut.
Can GMs spend auto aces?
Can GMs spend auto aces?
Field Team Six Bennies
- Ndreare
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Re: EP Review
I don't think it is so much as the options got over looked.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Maximilian
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Re: EP Review
No. VV already told me. You're not allowed. No.Pender Lumkiss wrote:Can GMs spend auto aces?
Unless it's for quality of loot given out to victorious Robot Armor pilots. Then ace away.
But only if aces are good. No aces for curses.
Maximilian
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Re: EP Review
Let's just say I won't be spending my EP on auto aces for my GM posts - I have GM fiat on my side if I REALLY need it.
Tales of the 17th SOG
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
- Daniel
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Re: EP Review
Approved.
I hate Auto Aces so I like it lol.
I do feel a Quarterly Award is nice. Only issue is how many months of Quarter do you have to be a particular level to earn level.
October. November I am bronze. December I do Gold. So. What do I qualify for. Make sende? Shrug.
But yes
Approved
I hate Auto Aces so I like it lol.
I do feel a Quarterly Award is nice. Only issue is how many months of Quarter do you have to be a particular level to earn level.
October. November I am bronze. December I do Gold. So. What do I qualify for. Make sende? Shrug.
But yes
Approved
- Fizzwaite Zipwidget
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Re: EP Review
Well the easy way is to say you qualify for whatever is the lowest level you pledged at during the quarter. So in that scenario you would get the Bronze rewards. If you stayed Gold or better for the next quarter then you would get the Gold rewards for that quarter and so on.Lars wrote:Approved.
I hate Auto Aces so I like it lol.
I do feel a Quarterly Award is nice. Only issue is how many months of Quarter do you have to be a particular level to earn level.
October. November I am bronze. December I do Gold. So. What do I qualify for. Make sende? Shrug.
But yes
Approved
Re: EP Review
I think it balances out in the long run. Like you said a lot of the ACs are worth more than 1 EP, but some are not even worth 1 EP. Being able to trade in the "garbage" cards for something you can use is a good idea. And with the "limit 2" it will not become a major increase even if a player has several characters.Venatus Vinco wrote:EDIT: Upon spelling that out...I wonder if allowing trading in Adventure Cards is too much...that would be a lot of extra EP per year even with the limit of 2.
Character
- Daniel
- Daniel (Lars)
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- Location: Former Alias (GM name) was Lars (2016-2022)
Re: EP Review
Long version...
Diamond: 3 EP per Quarter (12 per year) & all characters get an additional adventure card use (Max 2 EP Value)
Unused adventure card uses do not carry over. Cards can be exchanged for EP value, max 2 additional EP.
So basically, as diamond level, each Quarter one gets 3 EP and a Adventure Card, which if one does not like can be traded for 2 EP. Thus 5 EP each Quarter if that's how you want to take it. That works I think.
First sign up: All the big rewards.
next Q 5 EP
next Q 5 EP
next Q 5 EP
---------------
15 EP value and all the big rewards at sign up is good for a year.
I DO think a card should be worth 2 EP and not 1 EP.
Short version....
...
Diamond: 3 EP per Quarter (12 per year) & all characters get an additional adventure card use (Max 2 EP Value)
Unused adventure card uses do not carry over. Cards can be exchanged for EP value, max 2 additional EP.
So basically, as diamond level, each Quarter one gets 3 EP and a Adventure Card, which if one does not like can be traded for 2 EP. Thus 5 EP each Quarter if that's how you want to take it. That works I think.
First sign up: All the big rewards.
next Q 5 EP
next Q 5 EP
next Q 5 EP
---------------
15 EP value and all the big rewards at sign up is good for a year.
I DO think a card should be worth 2 EP and not 1 EP.
Short version....
...
- Radecliffe
- Diamond Patron
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Re: EP Review
I could be wrong but I thought that the new system is designed to replace the existing rewards. Though I believe that existing patrons will keep their existing rewards.
- Venatus Vinco
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Re: EP Review
Radecliff
I assume by:
I think the schedule works as Lars describes it.
VV
I assume by:
He means all the milestone awards that patrons get...when you sign up as a patron you get all existing milestones too (i.e. signature item and free character unlock). So your immediate benefit is the milestones then EP per quarter following that.Lars wrote:First sign up: All the big rewards.
I think the schedule works as Lars describes it.
VV
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- Radecliffe
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Re: EP Review
Ah, right. Forgot about the milestone stuff. Carry on.Venatus Vinco wrote:Radecliff
I assume by:He means all the milestone awards that patrons get...when you sign up as a patron you get all existing milestones too (i.e. signature item and free character unlock). So your immediate benefit is the milestones then EP per quarter following that.Lars wrote:First sign up: All the big rewards.
I think the schedule works as Lars describes it.
VV
Re: EP Review
It's worth noting that every year after the first, you'd be getting 20 EP a year, since you'd get 5 (assuming the two-card trade-in) each Quarter.
- Venatus Vinco
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Re: EP Review
Right. Which is why I was wary of trade-in for the cards.Freemage wrote:It's worth noting that every year after the first, you'd be getting 20 EP a year, since you'd get 5 (assuming the two-card trade-in) each Quarter.
VV
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- Daniel
- Daniel (Lars)
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Re: EP Review
20 EP a year seems fair. I’m paying $120 a year to a great cause....
5 EP a Q is not too much imo. Or 3 EP and a Card... gotta have some way to buy all the cool EP stuff on all 9 of my characters
5 EP a Q is not too much imo. Or 3 EP and a Card... gotta have some way to buy all the cool EP stuff on all 9 of my characters
- Ndreare
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Re: EP Review
I would be hesitant about trading in cards now that I think about it.
This quarter I have three characters and only used 1 card. So this would effectively mean I could normally just count on trading in those cards on two of my characters for the EP. If I need a card I buy it back, but if not I just get the bonus EP.
With that in mind it would be effectively the same as just giving that higher amount of EP and cause the inflation worried about that much quicker.
This quarter I have three characters and only used 1 card. So this would effectively mean I could normally just count on trading in those cards on two of my characters for the EP. If I need a card I buy it back, but if not I just get the bonus EP.
With that in mind it would be effectively the same as just giving that higher amount of EP and cause the inflation worried about that much quicker.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Venatus Vinco
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Re: EP Review
Is there something other than adventure cards we could throw in?
Maybe "VV's Christmas Grab Bag" given in the 4th quarter of each year - something I concoct for ruby and diamond patrons either from the EP menu or never seen before!
I am mostly kidding...is there something other than adventure cards we could throw in?
VV
Maybe "VV's Christmas Grab Bag" given in the 4th quarter of each year - something I concoct for ruby and diamond patrons either from the EP menu or never seen before!
I am mostly kidding...is there something other than adventure cards we could throw in?
VV
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Re: EP Review
Not sure, adventure cards are those cool things that sometimes give an edge, and sometimes don't.
An extra Benny would be nice, but then that is basically an extra edge and could create bitterness.
An 10% or 20% EP Menu item discount, but then I cannot predict how that would work.
PS: Separate note - Did we ever get an EP coupon for one item at 50% off one item? For some reason I remember reading something like that, but cannot remember where.
An extra Benny would be nice, but then that is basically an extra edge and could create bitterness.
An 10% or 20% EP Menu item discount, but then I cannot predict how that would work.
PS: Separate note - Did we ever get an EP coupon for one item at 50% off one item? For some reason I remember reading something like that, but cannot remember where.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Daniel
- Daniel (Lars)
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Re: EP Review
Whooooh hang on.
If its all, then all four trade in their cards for 8 EP and the 3 EP = 11 EP per Quarter.
If I had 6 Characters I could make 15 EP per Quarter this way.....
I need to think about this a sec. I was thinking 5 EP a Quarter seems fair. But as it reads it can be way more.
Maybe don't over think this?
Just give 5 EP a Quarter to the Patron (if Diamond), let the Player decide how to spent it?
EDIT - The just Give me the EP and I will decide how to spend it option. Towards Evil Auto Aces? Towards A-Cards? Maybe save up to get a big EP ticket item?
Patron Awards (given quarterly)
Bronze: 1 EP per Quarter (4 per year)
Silver: 2 EP per Quarter (8 per year)
Gold: 3 EP per Quarter (12 per year)
Ruby: 4 EP per Quarter (16 per year)
Diamond: 5 EP per Quarter (20 per year)
All this is in addition to any special milestones (e.g. Signature Item, character accounts, etc.).
side note: Gold Ruby and Diamond all look great, I (or whoever) am tempted to spend more for them!
PS I know Lars Account does not show Diamond but I am. FYI
All Characters get an additional card? I was reading it as one Card for the Patron. So I have 4 Characters and on one of them I get to add a card to.Diamond: 3 EP per Quarter (12 per year) & all characters get an additional adventure card use (Max 2 EP Value)
If its all, then all four trade in their cards for 8 EP and the 3 EP = 11 EP per Quarter.
If I had 6 Characters I could make 15 EP per Quarter this way.....
I need to think about this a sec. I was thinking 5 EP a Quarter seems fair. But as it reads it can be way more.
Maybe don't over think this?
Just give 5 EP a Quarter to the Patron (if Diamond), let the Player decide how to spent it?
EDIT - The just Give me the EP and I will decide how to spend it option. Towards Evil Auto Aces? Towards A-Cards? Maybe save up to get a big EP ticket item?
Patron Awards (given quarterly)
Bronze: 1 EP per Quarter (4 per year)
Silver: 2 EP per Quarter (8 per year)
Gold: 3 EP per Quarter (12 per year)
Ruby: 4 EP per Quarter (16 per year)
Diamond: 5 EP per Quarter (20 per year)
All this is in addition to any special milestones (e.g. Signature Item, character accounts, etc.).
side note: Gold Ruby and Diamond all look great, I (or whoever) am tempted to spend more for them!
PS I know Lars Account does not show Diamond but I am. FYI
- Radecliffe
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Re: EP Review
That was for the 60 patron milestone which I believe Lloyd said we are on track to meet this month if all the payments go through.RFT wrote:Not sure, adventure cards are those cool things that sometimes give an edge, and sometimes don't.
An extra Benny would be nice, but then that is basically an extra edge and could create bitterness.
An 10% or 20% EP Menu item discount, but then I cannot predict how that would work.
PS: Separate note - Did we ever get an EP coupon for one item at 50% off one item? For some reason I remember reading something like that, but cannot remember where.
Personally I like the idea of coupons. One coupon per quarter to use on the EP menu. The discount determined by your patron level. Use it or lose it. You will get another one next quarter.
Re: EP Review
Not quite. All your characters get a Card but trade in is for only 1 EP per card and a limit of two trade ins.Lars wrote:All Characters get an additional card? I was reading it as one Card for the Patron. So I have 4 Characters and on one of them I get to add a card to.Diamond: 3 EP per Quarter (12 per year) & all characters get an additional adventure card use (Max 2 EP Value)
If its all, then all four trade in their cards for 8 EP and the 3 EP = 11 EP per Quarter.
Regardless of having two or twenty characters you can "trade up" to a maximum of 5 EP per quarter.
Character
- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
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Re: EP Review
I think the use it or lose it nature, be it cards, bennies or coupons is what makes it work. That prevents rapid inflation of the EP economy.Radecliffe wrote: Personally I like the idea of coupons. One coupon per quarter to use on the EP menu. The discount determined by your patron level. Use it or lose it. You will get another one next quarter.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Pender Lumkiss
- Diamond Patron
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Re: EP Review
Something else to give:
- Admin for a day: Congrats you get to decide if a current house rule gets approved on not. Proposed ep 2
- characters birth day: for the rest of the quad your character is subject to the high adventure setting. Proposed ep 5
- Ladies man, or woman as the case may be: for the rest of the quad when possible ladies throw them selves in front of your character per the fanatics setting rule. Proposed ep 10.
- Dres Marbles Left fan club: as a proud member of the fan club of perhaps the most awesome rock band to grace north america you have been given the exclusive die hard fan music box. This technowizard device is able to rift in a member of the band they not only play their musical speciality but make one roll for the scene to help you out. The member of Dres Marbles Left also gets a benny for their participation
- 1ep-Cantrell and her soundbooth show up and lay down a dazzle of lights and preset beats.
- 2ep-Fire hawk shows up and sets your stage on fire with pyrotechnics unseen.
- 3ep- Libertas and his mystic electric key board arrive giving an electronic extravaganza
- 4ep- Jude and his love ballad croon comes out and sways the crowd
- 5ep- the beautiful bomb shell known as Z arrives and lays down some heavy bass rythms that are sure to get your feet pounding
- 6ep- Bane steps onto the stage and shreds your ear drums with a lead guitar solo that eric claypton wishes he could perform.
- 7ep- Max and his girlfriend Nadine pay you a visit you will not soon forget.
- 8ep- Vick or as some call him Markus will come out and give you a vocal performance that will not only have you chanting humans first, but tossing your sweaty shirt onto the stage.
Field Team Six Bennies
- Ndreare
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Re: EP Review
Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope!Pender Lumkiss wrote:Something else to give:
- Admin for a day: Congrats you get to decide if a current house rule gets approved on not. Proposed ep 2
Can you imagine the evil unleashed on our awesome games from this?
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Pender Lumkiss
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Re: EP Review
What about 3ep call it Once more with feeling. Gain another use of a per session ability.
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- Maximilian
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Re: EP Review
Do the members of Dres Marbles Left receive the EP spent to summon them? I'm in favor of this.
Maximilian
- Logan Wright
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- Venatus Vinco
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Re: EP Review
Ok,
In lieu of adventure cards (which you can buy with EP if you want them) we'll go for discounts on one purchase per quarter instead of adventure cards (rounding to nearest whole number). This will help with bigger ticket items like character accounts, signature items, really anything 5 EP or 10 EP and above...does it have to be one item or for a single transaction with multiple items?
Silver: 10%
Gold: 10%
Ruby: 20%
Diamond: 25%
I like "Once More with Feeling", 3 EP sounds right.
Last chance to chime in before the quarter ends.
VV
In lieu of adventure cards (which you can buy with EP if you want them) we'll go for discounts on one purchase per quarter instead of adventure cards (rounding to nearest whole number). This will help with bigger ticket items like character accounts, signature items, really anything 5 EP or 10 EP and above...does it have to be one item or for a single transaction with multiple items?
Silver: 10%
Gold: 10%
Ruby: 20%
Diamond: 25%
I like "Once More with Feeling", 3 EP sounds right.
Last chance to chime in before the quarter ends.
VV
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- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
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Re: EP Review
Would the discounts be combined with the EP rewards or in place of?Venatus Vinco wrote:Ok,
In lieu of adventure cards (which you can buy with EP if you want them) we'll go for discounts on one purchase per quarter instead of adventure cards (rounding to nearest whole number). This will help with bigger ticket items like character accounts, signature items, really anything 5 EP or 10 EP and above...does it have to be one item or for a single transaction with multiple items?
Silver: 10%
Gold: 10%
Ruby: 20%
Diamond: 25%
I like "Once More with Feeling", 3 EP sounds right.
Last chance to chime in before the quarter ends.
VV
Also, I like the idea of them simply applying on all purchases.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Venatus Vinco
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Re: EP Review
In addition, they replace adventure cards in the previous schema.RFT wrote:Would the discounts be combined with the EP rewards or in place of?
Also, I like the idea of them simply applying on all purchases.
VV
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Re: EP Review
+1Venatus Vinco wrote:In addition, they replace adventure cards in the previous schema.RFT wrote:Would the discounts be combined with the EP rewards or in place of?
Also, I like the idea of them simply applying on all purchases.
VV
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Pender Lumkiss
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Re: EP Review
15ep: All about the poutine: you are aided by the timely arrival of a Québécois glitterboy. Enjoy that 4d12+6 medium burst template.
Field Team Six Bennies
- Jude Maverick
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- Pender Lumkiss
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Re: EP Review
Maybe only Jude can spend his ep on this oneJude Maverick wrote:Mmmm...poutine...
Field Team Six Bennies
- Jude Maverick
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Re: EP Review
Well, it was a Quebecois redhead that got Jude in trouble in the CS, so...
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- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
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Re: EP Review
As this has been finalized and EP solidified at the new cost can I remove the sticky from this?
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Radecliffe
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Re: EP Review
With regards to the new coupons do the discounts round up, down or to the nearest whole number? I'm asking for a friend...
Re: EP Review
Yeah, I saw RFT use his 25% coupon and how you posted it after I posted this so that's about what I expected. Thanks.
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Re: EP Review
From Gchat, RFT and I were spit balling a group buy in about 40 EP per rank of edge ( I initially thought 80). A one time purchase that sort of gives that group something they are known for.
Signature Edge ( edge level, applies to all members, if members already have said edge gives a +2 bonus or furthers it to the next edge)
So like the group decides on what it wants to be known for. Giant Killers, Woodsmen, Gageteers, Eagle Eyes, berserks, never surprised and so forth. GMs work in any required rolls to something that will fit, maybe using spell casting instead of weird science, or spirit if need be.
Thoughts?
Signature Edge ( edge level, applies to all members, if members already have said edge gives a +2 bonus or furthers it to the next edge)
So like the group decides on what it wants to be known for. Giant Killers, Woodsmen, Gageteers, Eagle Eyes, berserks, never surprised and so forth. GMs work in any required rolls to something that will fit, maybe using spell casting instead of weird science, or spirit if need be.
Thoughts?
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- High Command
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Re: EP Review
And what happens to that if the players drop out? Someone invested in something and can't play anymore, so they lose that investment. Someone else comes in, and gets the effect at no investment.
Why not just have it be something the GM gives out if they feel its appropriate.
Why not just have it be something the GM gives out if they feel its appropriate.
Tales of the 17th SOG
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
- Pender Lumkiss
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Re: EP Review
They would need to pay the ep investment, looks like maybe 5ep per player to gain the benefit of the group trait.High Command wrote:And what happens to that if the players drop out? Someone invested in something and can't play anymore, so they lose that investment. Someone else comes in, and gets the effect at no investment.
Why not just have it be something the GM gives out if they feel its appropriate.
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Re: EP Review
Spent EP would not be refunded.
But the new player pays the 5EP and in game it is him finally being fully invested in whatever magic or force bonds the group.
But the new player pays the 5EP and in game it is him finally being fully invested in whatever magic or force bonds the group.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
Re: EP Review
'Twas the night before Christmas, when all thro' the Camp
Not a creature was stirring, not even a vamp
The stockings were hung by the Q mobile with Spikes,
In hopes that the Simvans would just take a Hike,
The mercs were nestled all snug in their bed ,
While visions of Flying Devils filled them with dread.
And Cory wrapped in her dragon and I near my hover
Had just settled our brains for this stake out cover.
When out on the field there arose such a clash,
I sprang from my sleep to see what Timmy had smashed.
Activated my Armor, and saw all this trash
The blood on the beast and holes in it’s Hide,
the flesh filled maw filled Merlaggon with Pride.
When, what to my wondering eyes should I spot
But devil with horns, more Simvans we should have fought,
With a little old shaman, so Deadly with a stick
I knew in a moment that he would be Drake’s Pick.
More rapid than Quick flex the enemy they Bound,
that is when Qoat decided to take them all down
“Now! Timmy, now! Qoat, now! Saul, and Sparky,
“On! Merlaggon on! Sinder, on! Drake and Cory;
“To the top of the Pyre! to the top of the Pile!
“Now Burn away! Burn away! Burn away all!”
As did CS’ers before the wild Dragon does fly,
They meet with Hot Flames, they’re smoke filled the sky;
So up to the mountain-top the ashes did settle,
this proved the hopes of the first as they showed all their Mettle:
And then in a twinkling, I heard from the Sky
The vision of Sayeen and Fell beaming with Pride
As I threw down a head, and was turning around,
Timmy did jump and landed with a bound
He was dressed all in Blood, from his head to his boot,
And his armor were all tarnish’d He thought he look Cute;
A bundle of Weapons was found in a sack,
And he Sounded like a commander not taking any Flack
His eyes - how they twinkled! And then went dim,
“Qoat my eyes, crap it, just blurred, this not Again;
Qoat with a Notion did scramble and up quick with a Bat
Gave Tim wink and hit his metal head with a thwack.
Tim’s eyes they did cross but sight was restore
he unleashed the railgun with a loud mighty Roar
the blood it did splash his friends and his foes.
He had a bloodied the Devils Body because that’s how it goes
the arms went that way and the legs went there too
that is when the first saw not one but two
Saul jumped in to the fray with gusto and Glee
While the new guy Drake just wanted some Tea
Cory and Merlaggon came in with some Fire
And Sinder teamed with Sparky to add to the Devils Ire
Quot Flipped a big switch and tuned a small knob,
And with a cloud of rain the First just finished this job
With a deep heavy sigh and a feeling of relief
They looted the poor Bastards just like a smart thief
They sprung to the rides both happy with glee
You could tell Timmy was proud as tear of W D
And away they all flew, like a jet with its afters
I guessed they showed them who were the Masters.
But I heard Them exclaim, ere they moved out of shot
the loot we acquired should buy us a Yacht.
Not a creature was stirring, not even a vamp
The stockings were hung by the Q mobile with Spikes,
In hopes that the Simvans would just take a Hike,
The mercs were nestled all snug in their bed ,
While visions of Flying Devils filled them with dread.
And Cory wrapped in her dragon and I near my hover
Had just settled our brains for this stake out cover.
When out on the field there arose such a clash,
I sprang from my sleep to see what Timmy had smashed.
Activated my Armor, and saw all this trash
The blood on the beast and holes in it’s Hide,
the flesh filled maw filled Merlaggon with Pride.
When, what to my wondering eyes should I spot
But devil with horns, more Simvans we should have fought,
With a little old shaman, so Deadly with a stick
I knew in a moment that he would be Drake’s Pick.
More rapid than Quick flex the enemy they Bound,
that is when Qoat decided to take them all down
“Now! Timmy, now! Qoat, now! Saul, and Sparky,
“On! Merlaggon on! Sinder, on! Drake and Cory;
“To the top of the Pyre! to the top of the Pile!
“Now Burn away! Burn away! Burn away all!”
As did CS’ers before the wild Dragon does fly,
They meet with Hot Flames, they’re smoke filled the sky;
So up to the mountain-top the ashes did settle,
this proved the hopes of the first as they showed all their Mettle:
And then in a twinkling, I heard from the Sky
The vision of Sayeen and Fell beaming with Pride
As I threw down a head, and was turning around,
Timmy did jump and landed with a bound
He was dressed all in Blood, from his head to his boot,
And his armor were all tarnish’d He thought he look Cute;
A bundle of Weapons was found in a sack,
And he Sounded like a commander not taking any Flack
His eyes - how they twinkled! And then went dim,
“Qoat my eyes, crap it, just blurred, this not Again;
Qoat with a Notion did scramble and up quick with a Bat
Gave Tim wink and hit his metal head with a thwack.
Tim’s eyes they did cross but sight was restore
he unleashed the railgun with a loud mighty Roar
the blood it did splash his friends and his foes.
He had a bloodied the Devils Body because that’s how it goes
the arms went that way and the legs went there too
that is when the first saw not one but two
Saul jumped in to the fray with gusto and Glee
While the new guy Drake just wanted some Tea
Cory and Merlaggon came in with some Fire
And Sinder teamed with Sparky to add to the Devils Ire
Quot Flipped a big switch and tuned a small knob,
And with a cloud of rain the First just finished this job
With a deep heavy sigh and a feeling of relief
They looted the poor Bastards just like a smart thief
They sprung to the rides both happy with glee
You could tell Timmy was proud as tear of W D
And away they all flew, like a jet with its afters
I guessed they showed them who were the Masters.
But I heard Them exclaim, ere they moved out of shot
the loot we acquired should buy us a Yacht.
Sinder Baron: Burster (Master Psi)
http://savagerifts.com/sr/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=190
Nicknames: Little Hotfoot, Phoenix,
http://savagerifts.com/sr/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=190
Nicknames: Little Hotfoot, Phoenix,
OOC Comments
- High Command
- The Savage Inquisition
- Posts: 1943
- Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:10 am
Re: EP Review
That is not a single 40 EP buy-in then, that is a 5 EP per player buy-in that requires everyone to be on board.RFT wrote:Spent EP would not be refunded.
But the new player pays the 5EP and in game it is him finally being fully invested in whatever magic or force bonds the group.
Or I as GM can just hook them up. And I happen to know both of you do the same thing. I'm all about player agency and all, but this is a bit nutters.
Tales of the 17th SOG
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
"In so far as you are concerned, I am the right arm of High Command itself. You are my Fist, be ready to strike at any moment." Major Killian Gregor, 3rd SOG Battalion, CSSD, Chi-Town.
- Pender Lumkiss
- Diamond Patron
- Posts: 3648
- Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:00 pm
Re: EP Review
It was just a thought... Like say the 1st all wanted to have access to the gageteer edge and be known in the legion as a group that tinkered and could whip up a gaget to save the day. Or maybe the 13th wanted to be known as woodsmen...High Command wrote:That is not a single 40 EP buy-in then, that is a 5 EP per player buy-in that requires everyone to be on board.RFT wrote:Spent EP would not be refunded.
But the new player pays the 5EP and in game it is him finally being fully invested in whatever magic or force bonds the group.
Or I as GM can just hook them up. And I happen to know both of you do the same thing. I'm all about player agency and all, but this is a bit nutters.
Or maybe the vampire kingdom hunters wanted to be known as champions and so forth.
Field Team Six Bennies
- Venatus Vinco
- Bronze Patron
- Posts: 2872
- Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:30 pm
Re: EP Review
The single "known for" edge can probably be done by a GM now, for example everyone in the 1st SET has the Common Bond edge by virtue of a magic item given to each of them by a Native American shaman. Not sure if there's value for your EP here.
I do like the idea of group benefits...I raised it in chat as a possibility when I thought about each unit being a "character" with its own unique attributes and edges. If that were the case then I could see using EP to buy advances for the unit/company. It would be an investment (i.e. gone once spent) but you could build up a mercenary unit or famous military unit that way.
I recently purchased this PDF on making super powered organizations. I could see a similar system for us. However, was noted in chat, this also means more book keeping which was generally frowned upon.
VV
I do like the idea of group benefits...I raised it in chat as a possibility when I thought about each unit being a "character" with its own unique attributes and edges. If that were the case then I could see using EP to buy advances for the unit/company. It would be an investment (i.e. gone once spent) but you could build up a mercenary unit or famous military unit that way.
I recently purchased this PDF on making super powered organizations. I could see a similar system for us. However, was noted in chat, this also means more book keeping which was generally frowned upon.
VV
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- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
- Posts: 4410
- Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 12:55 pm
- Location: Skagit County, Washington
- Contact:
Re: EP Review
For Shaintar I made a setting rule that effectively gives everyone common bond.
But I did not consider doing it in the 99. Because I did not know how much GM rights a GM maintains in PBP. After playing in more games I see it is much looser and I will be implementing it.
But I still like the idea of a EP sink for groups.
Edit: Implemented in the 99
But I did not consider doing it in the 99. Because I did not know how much GM rights a GM maintains in PBP. After playing in more games I see it is much looser and I will be implementing it.
But I still like the idea of a EP sink for groups.
Edit: Implemented in the 99
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Ndreare
- Savage Siri
- Posts: 4410
- Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 12:55 pm
- Location: Skagit County, Washington
- Contact:
Re: Explorer Points Menu
Sounds good to me.
I myself was going to be asking eventually, because my plan is to earn enough EP to make the MARS I want (with all three rolls being Smart & Learned). I am guessing he will be a 50 EP character, but he will be worth every bit of the effort.
I myself was going to be asking eventually, because my plan is to earn enough EP to make the MARS I want (with all three rolls being Smart & Learned). I am guessing he will be a 50 EP character, but he will be worth every bit of the effort.
, and of course update your signatures!
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
"Possible and practical are two comrades who rarely see eye to eye."
Rob Towell
- Venatus Vinco
- Bronze Patron
- Posts: 2872
- Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:30 pm
Re: EP Review
Hello,
I made some changes to the EP Menu to Pilot for this Quarter.
http://savagerifts.com/sr/viewtopic.php ... 8&p=26#p26
If, at the end of the quarter, we feel like no one really missed these items then we will remove them completely. If, they were greatly missed we will look at our options.
VV
I made some changes to the EP Menu to Pilot for this Quarter.
http://savagerifts.com/sr/viewtopic.php ... 8&p=26#p26
If, at the end of the quarter, we feel like no one really missed these items then we will remove them completely. If, they were greatly missed we will look at our options.
VV
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